No hand over heart during the pledge?

[Melly]

Just curious, what is your thoughts about Obama? I was doing some research and there are quit a bit of things that bother me about him, now I was all for him until I started researching him, at the time I wanted anyone but clinton in office, but after this I decided that even she'd be better, but since shes no longer in the running, its between him and McCain... I don't like either of them...

But this bugs me the most, what do you think?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KlfCLl1r2SQ (his preacher or erm EX preacher, doesn't do it any justice, but the hand over they heart thing is what really gets me...)

[capricieux]

I know the picture you're referring to. I think people are trying to create something out of nothing. People don't know WHAT was going on when that single picture was snapped (it looks edited to me but that's just me lol). It is not a crime to not place your hand over your heart, I don't do it but I stand out of respect. I think it was on here (or perhaps some other forum) that someone stated that it wasn't the pledge, it was the nat'l anthem (if that makes a difference).

As for the video, I'll comment it in a minute after I watch it.

Okay, I watched it. Well, Obama and his preacher are two different people. He may not always agree with EVERYTHING he says. Infact, Obama has chosen to disassociate himself with him. My mom said that what Rev Wright said has some truth (idk if she's referring to that particular speech) but it is not the time or place to talk about it. She thinks that Rev Wright is just using Obama to get his name out there. Who really knows.

[Melly]

I know the picture you're referring to. I think people are trying to create something out of nothing. People don't know WHAT was going on when that single picture was snapped (it looks edited to me but that's just me lol). It is not a crime to not place your hand over your heart, I don't do it but I stand out of respect. I think it was on here (or perhaps some other forum) that someone stated that it wasn't the pledge, it was the nat'l anthem (if that makes a difference).

As for the video, I'll comment it in a minute after I watch it.

Yes I'm well aware that it could be a number of reasons why, but I know I was always raised a hand over the heart even in the National Anthem, is respect for the country, though he could have just got distracted I'm aware of that... Of course its not against the law lol, but its respect for the country, and he will be running the country if he wins.

[Nora]

The speech is weird but its obvious that Obama has nothing to do with it and doesn't support it because he'd know this would get in the way of people voting for. I don't really know why holding your hand over the heart is so important, does it have to do with the national anthem? I do think it's just one picture and shouldn't be taken that seriously, as long as his best interest is the country then it doesn't really matter where he puts his hands. (again, I don't know why that's important..)

[Sergio]

I'll just quote Greg.

You should know that was for the national anthem and not the pledge of allegiance. Do you know the context it was taken in as well? No, I didn't think so.



The hand over your heart during the national anthem is optional, at least from what I learned in Kindergarten.

[TaintedPearls]

Yes I'm well aware that it could be a number of reasons why, but I know I was always raised a hand over the heart even in the National Anthem, is respect for the country, though he could have just got distracted I'm aware of that... Of course its not against the law lol, but its respect for the country, and he will be running the country if he wins.

i'm sure he meant no disrespect by not placing his hand over his heart. some people don't place it because of religious reasons. on my high school graduation, there were a few people who didn't because they were muslim. they didn't even stand. at least he stood for it. i won't hold that against him. out of the candidates, i feel that he would be the best. people are trying to find any reason, no matter how minute, to sway voters. i think they should focus more on what the person will bring to the table. rely on facts and nothing more.

[GREGO]

lol, who cares? I never put my hand over my heart either. Silly little gestures mean nothing.

[Melly]

i'm sure he meant no disrespect by not placing his hand over his heart. some people don't place it because of religious reasons. on my high school graduation, there were a few people who didn't because they were muslim. they didn't even stand. at least he stood for it. i won't hold that against him. out of the candidates, i feel that he would be the best. people are trying to find any reason, no matter how minute, to sway voters. i think they should focus more on what the person will bring to the table. rely on facts and nothing more.

Well regardless, there are things like him being for abortions, that I don't like... I'm so far against abortions, so that is major to me... I can see past it, you are correct, atleast he did stand...

I don't want McCain either, so its not like i'm digging to find bad on both, I just seen this and I looked it up on snopes.com and it is truth... There are some non truths to things too...

If you want to get the scope http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/obama.asp

[Andrew2]

lol, who cares? I never put my hand over my heart either. Silly little gestures mean nothing.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y188/Karl02/nazi34.bmp

[TaintedPearls]

Well regardless, there are things like him being for abortions, that I don't like... I'm so far against abortions, so that is major to me... I can see past it, you are correct, atleast he did stand...

I don't want McCain either, so its not like i'm digging to find bad on both, I just seen this and I looked it up on snopes.com and it is truth... There are some non truths to things too...

If you want to get the scope http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/obama.asp

i've read so many things on snopes that turn out to be myths that i take what's listed there with a grain of salt. one that sticks out was the larvae that grew in the lady's tit. i'm against abortions as well but at the same time i understand that everyone doesn't feel the way i feel. i'm just trying to look at the bigger picture and decide what would be best for the country as a whole. McCain wouldn't defo not be the answer on that. I think Hilary would've been good but she stepped out so now I'm rooting for Obama.

[GREGO]

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y188/Karl02/nazi34.bmp


it's just another gesture to me, its up to the viewer to decide what it means to them and weather they want to be offended by it or not.



they must be waving to the baby daddy :)

Well regardless, there are things like him being for abortions, that I don't like... I'm so far against abortions, so that is major to me... I can see past it, you are correct, atleast he did stand...

I don't want McCain either, so its not like i'm digging to find bad on both, I just seen this and I looked it up on snopes.com and it is truth... There are some non truths to things too...

If you want to get the scope http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/obama.asp


Abortion has nothing to do with this thread. If you start another topic in the Obama section on abortion I'll gladly come in and debate you.

[Melly]

i've read so many things on snopes that turn out to be myths that i take what's listed there with a grain of salt. one that sticks out was the larvae that grew in the lady's tit. i'm against abortions as well but at the same time i understand that everyone doesn't feel the way i feel. i'm just trying to look at the bigger picture and decide what would be best for the country as a whole. McCain wouldn't defo not be the answer on that. I think Hilary would've been good but she stepped out so now I'm rooting for Obama.

Lol don't get me started on why I think Hilary stepped out... that'll prolly open up a whole nother can of warms lol... but just put it this away, if Obama gets the hot chair, I have a feeling he'll be assassinated.

[Melly]

it's just another gesture to me, its up to the viewer to decide what it means to them and weather they want to be offended by it or not.



they must be waving to the baby daddy

ROFL thats funny

[Ajay]

it was for the national anthem not the pledge. if it was for the pledge they all ****ed up... since they aren't even looking at the giant flag behind them.

[rizza]

I'm for McCain, and even I think the hand over the heart thing is a ridiculous grab into thin air to attack Obama. Have you ever been to a professional sports game during the national anthem? people do much worse than that. Did you know your supposed to have a spotlight on the flag during night? How many people do that? It's the same basis. That picture is purely propaganda.

As for the hate speech thing, that bothers me a lot, and I'll leave it at that.

[Andrew2]

it was for the national anthem not the pledge. if it was for the pledge they all ****ed up... since they aren't even looking at the giant flag behind them.

hahahaha...

[CharmRoyal]

it was for the national anthem not the pledge. if it was for the pledge they all ****ed up... since they aren't even looking at the giant flag behind them.

Why hasn't anyone said that before?

(Y)

[Kasami2k4]

In my school, we never looked at the flag either :(

[Greg-J]

It wasn't the damn Pledge of Allegiance for the last time. It was the National Anthem.


Even if it was the Pledge of Allegiance, I hardly think Barrack Obama or any other presidential hopeful is going to publicly or privately refuse to respect the Pledge of Allegiance. What if someone yelled something or it was just getting started/over... Who knows.

Personally I like debating things I can put into context.

[jordansure]

I heard that if he wins the election, he's not going to take the oath of office.
I forgot what it's called. It's different though. Idk if that's true. :P

[Greg-J]

I heard that if he wins the election, he's not going to take the oath of office.
I forgot what it's called. It's different though. Idk if that's true. :P
Because he's Muslum, right?


:dots:

[Melly]

I heard that if he wins the election, he's not going to take the oath of office.
I forgot what it's called. It's different though. Idk if that's true. :P

Yeah My dad was telling me about that, he said he was gonna vote for Hilary cus of it lol.... but shes no longer in so now I'm curious of who now..

[Melly]

Because he's Muslum, right?


:dots:

He isn't Muslum, his dad was muslum, right? He was in a Muslum school for 2yrs, but he is a Christian.

[Greg-J]

He isn't Muslum, his dad was muslum, right? He was in a Muslum school for 2yrs, but he is a Christian.
My post was pure sarcasm. I'm well aware he's not Muslim.


Although frankly, I don't care what his religious affiliation is as long as he's not a Scientologist.

[jordansure]

I don't know. But it really makes me think of who should be best for the position. -_-

Maybe Hillary will bounce back and take her campaign off suspension. :)

[Greg-J]

Hillary wants to be president too bad for me to vote for her. Nobody should focus on getting power more than they should focus on explaining to people why the deserve that power and unfortunately, Clinton never did that for me. If she wasn't bashing Obama, she was talking about how good her campaign was doing...

[Melly]

I don't know. But it really makes me think of who should be best for the position. -_-

Maybe Hillary will bounce back and take her campaign off suspension. :)

My theory on Hilary, is shes gonna be Obama's Vise Pres, if he gets it... I won't say my other theory, cus I know people will prolly stone me for it :stuart:

[jordansure]

Either way she's going to run again in 2012. :poop:
She just needs some better points on why she should win.

[CharmRoyal]

My theory on Hilary, is shes gonna be Obama's Vise Pres, if he gets it... I won't say my other theory, cus I know people will prolly stone me for it :stuart:

I think I know your other theory and it's mine too

[jordansure]

My theory on Hilary, is shes gonna be Obama's Vise Pres, if he gets it... I won't say my other theory, cus I know people will prolly stone me for it :stuart:

What's your opinion? Hahaha.
If it's bad, just PM me. I must knowww.

[rizza]

I agree with Greg, Hilliary wanted the power wayyyyyy too much. A lot of her plans would increase government control, and interaction, something I'm 100% against. I would choose Obama over Hiliary any day of the week. The Clinton's have been covering up their dirt tracks for close to 20 years now.

Obama's Islam connections are a little blurry, because there is no legitimate proof he practiced the religion. Islam has gotten a bad name, because of the uneducated in the Middle East that let it run their lives, along with the idiots that take it literally until they become a martyr. It truly isn't a bad religion, there are Christian idiots too. My problem is, if Obama practiced the religion then he shouldn't be lying about it now, it's up in the air, and no one really knows if he really did practice it or not.

[Greg-J]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say this theory is that Obama will be assassinated because he's black and Hillary will become president anyway? I would like to think we've moved beyond that kind of hate by now. A lot of skinheads will be pissed off, but I don't know if anyone is going to go to that kind of extreme. If Bush of all people got away without a single attempt in 8 years, Obama should be fine.


He's not going to run with her. No way, no how. If he does, he's a damn fool. Yes he'll get her votes and definitely win, but I just don't see him compromising himself like that.

[Melly]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say this theory is that Obama will be assassinated because he's black and Hillary will become president anyway? I would like to think we've moved beyond that kind of hate by now. A lot of skinheads will be pissed off, but I don't know if anyone is going to go to that kind of extreme. If Bush of all people got away without a single attempt in 8 years, Obama should be fine.


He's not going to run with her. No way, no how. If he does, he's a damn fool. Yes he'll get her votes and definitely win, but I just don't see him compromising himself like that.

Well assassin is part of the theory, but not the entire theory... Its really a good theory..

[houseoflayouts]

Who cares about a hand over our hearts i wish all government would be assassinated. Not one damn government official gives 2 $hits about us Americans anymore it's all about personal gain and what else can they take away from us Rights or Taxes? They all tell great lies until they are in the front door then it's " i never said i would do that for the American People " So my opinion on them is screw them all hope they all see the big :gun_bandana: :gun_bandana: :gun_bandana: :gun_bandana: Sorry to sound so sour but i seen this post and it got me started once again. ok back to business.....lol

[misterproline]

**** happens - hand over heart or not he is still standing.

[minnseoelite]

rofl @ this thread, please...

[Kasami2k4]

Gotta love all the prejudgment in this thread, making fun of hilary even though there's like.. no dirt on her, but even Obamas preacher doesn't want him to be president >.> Someone who was always there to help spread the hate. :(

...People are annoying.

[Sugarlipz]

I'm not for him, but I don't think he's satan or anything. How much they pick on him down to every tiny detail is ridiculous. So hes made some mistakes big whoop. We will never have a perfect president. The only reason I'm ever for or against someone is based on their policies and beliefs on ALL topics.

[shayna107]

they both are scumbags...

RON PAUL!!!!!!!!!!!!!:hammer:

[Kasami2k4]

they both are scumbags...

RON PAUL!!!!!!!!!!!!!:hammer:

I totally Agree :/ Ron Paul seemed like the best choice. And Obamas not black.. :/ He's an oreo. His moms white, so God knows why he went to that KKK-ish church.

[shayna107]

Neither one of the big runners left are for we the people.

Ron Paul was gonna get BIG OUT OF Control gov-3rnm3nt out of our freekin faces and pocket books. and restore the freedom and American Dream now it's close to hopeless.

[Kasami2k4]

Yeah, move to Canada like I did >.>

[NYCBORN]

Yes I'm well aware that it could be a number of reasons why, but I know I was always raised a hand over the heart even in the National Anthem, is respect for the country, though he could have just got distracted I'm aware of that... Of course its not against the law lol, but its respect for the country, and he will be running the country if he wins.


Ohh just say it you don't like the black man. Jokin.

Lying to the country you are supposed to serve or not putting your hand over your heart during the national anthem?

[NYCBORN]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say this theory is that Obama will be assassinated because he's black and Hillary will become president anyway? I would like to think we've moved beyond that kind of hate by now. A lot of skinheads will be pissed off, but I don't know if anyone is going to go to that kind of extreme. If Bush of all people got away without a single attempt in 8 years, Obama should be fine.


He's not going to run with her. No way, no how. If he does, he's a damn fool. Yes he'll get her votes and definitely win, but I just don't see him compromising himself like that.

Theres only one way to solve that and that's make Oprah VP. Then all the racists will have a Black Woman as president and piss off all the skinheads even more.

[Kasami2k4]

I'd totally vote for oprah =o Shes proven what a good good woman she is throughout her lifetime.

[gowanstl24]

Here is my opinion about the pledge specifically, for what it's worth.

I was an air traffic controller in the Marine Corps for 8 years. I was a Marine with a brain - I'm just saying that because I know the stigma...

Anyway. I was a damn good Marine if I do say so myself. I was hard-working, strong, and competent. To this day, 7 years after I got out, I'm still getting compliments from people I worked with back in the day, both to my face and to my husband who is still on active duty.

Okay, now that that's out of the way:

One day, while on barracks duty, I went to the base movie theater during my dinner break with a couple of my Marines. I was a Sgt (E-5) at the time. I was wearing my "war belt", which meant I had to wear my cover (hat) indoors. Before movies start in base theaters, a video comes on with the National Anthem, and then the Marine's Hymn.

Whenever you hear the National Anthem you have to stand at attention. If you have your cover on, you have to salute facing the nearest flag, and in this case there was a flag waving on the video, so we had to salute that.

I had been up for 48 hours straight and had a TOTAL and rare bonehead moment. All I did was get up from my seat and stand at attention. I didn't salute. I knew better but I just had an off moment. Some guy behind me was there in civvies with his son and he made a comment out loud about how people are supposed to salute... I felt like the biggest jerk and while my Marines were sitting in front of me and didn't see my faux pas, I was still quietly embarrassed for an entire week. I still feel like an a-hole thinking about that night.

This is what happened to Obama that day. He had been traveling and campaigning, and he said in an interview that he was super tired, and was dazed right then. He said it was the first time he hadn't put his hand over his heart. People, it happens to the best of us. Give the guy a break.

P.S. I would vote for Oprah too. :yes:

[Greg-J]

Good story. +green



(I need to lower my rep power. I swear I just gave you 4 or 5 green bars :2guns:

[Andrew2]

OPRAH? Hell no, you guys are ridiculous. :(
Good thing there's no way in hell she can be president.

Yeah, move to Canada like I did >.>

You moved to Canada because of a weiner, not for political reasons.

[Melly]

OPRAH? Hell no, you guys are ridiculous. :(
Good thing there's no way in hell she can be president.



You moved to Canada because of a weiner, not for political reasons.

I almost chocked on my ice reading that last line...

I agree with ya on oprah, I don't care for her to much.... Not cus shes black, I have nothing against blacks, I just don't agree with her a lot of the times.

[Andrew2]

She's just an opinionated woman who "thinks" she can change the world, God only knows if she became any sort of Government or Political figure she'd be focused on her own moral values rather than think of the entire country.

She's old now anyways, She leaves alot of her ideas and thinking to her producers and stuff.

[gowanstl24]

Good story. +green



(I need to lower my rep power. I swear I just gave you 4 or 5 green bars :2guns:

lol Thanks Greg :)

[gowanstl24]

I looove Oprah and I stand behind the fact that I would vote for her...but like any sane person, I would have to see her on the campaign trail to know for sure.

Maybe it's because I'm a peace-luvin' hippy from San Francisco, but people around the world love her, and I think she would make a great mediator. Maybe she could being peace to some of the chaos out there. I think she would be good with money even though I'm sure she doesn't manage her own money anymore and hasn't for years - but at least she knows who to go to and how to invest. I also think she would put America first. She's all about helping the disadvantaged because of her upbringing. I think she's an honorable woman, unlike Hillary. I don't trust her one bit.

Regardless, for now I'm an Obama girl, all the way. (L)(L)

[barcodeunit]

http://images.cafepress.com/product/244505396v2_240x240_Front.jpg

[rufus]

It wasn't the damn Pledge of Allegiance for the last time. It was the National Anthem.


Even if it was the Pledge of Allegiance, I hardly think Barrack Obama or any other presidential hopeful is going to publicly or privately refuse to respect the Pledge of Allegiance. What if someone yelled something or it was just getting started/over... Who knows.

Personally I like debating things I can put into context.

Now ya know it wasnt at the beginning or the end but actually he did it through the entire ordeal. Just click the image to actually watch it on video.

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u90/snopesbinary/Politics/th_abc_obama_anthem_071022a.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u90/snopesbinary/Politics/?action=view&current=abc_obama_anthem_071022a.flv)

[misterproline]

Now ya know it wasnt at the beginning or the end but actually he did it through the entire ordeal. Just click the image to actually watch it on video.

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u90/snopesbinary/Politics/th_abc_obama_anthem_071022a.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u90/snopesbinary/Politics/?action=view&current=abc_obama_anthem_071022a.flv)

Honestly - who cares? He's still standing isn't he? I don't find this as a sign of disrespect at all.

Here is an example of the same case that you are stating above that is total disrespect.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ew9G-qYP8Uo&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ew9G-qYP8Uo&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[capricieux]

Honestly - who cares? He's still standing isn't he? I don't find this as a sign of disrespect at all.

Here is an example of the same case that you are stating above that is total disrespect.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ew9G-qYP8Uo&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ew9G-qYP8Uo&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Ah, you beat me to it.

[rufus]

Honestly - who cares? He's still standing isn't he? I don't find this as a sign of disrespect at all.

Here is an example of the same case that you are stating above that is total disrespect.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ew9G-qYP8Uo&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ew9G-qYP8Uo&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Oh yeah I forgot this Cat was running for the office of the President of the United States.................NOT

Not even a comparison at all.....Please try again.